Transcription - Decentering Work, Recentering Values
House Of Peregrine (01:03)
Welcome back to the House of Peregrine podcast, where we explore the inner and outer journeys of those who move.
House Of Peregrine (01:10)
Today I'm joined by Doris Dario,
House Of Peregrine (01:12)
a relocation coach, speaker, and mentor who guides individuals, couples, and families on their journey to finding a place that suits their values for a phase, a season, or a lifetime. With decades of experience in global business leadership and a deeply personal understanding of reinvention, Doris has lived her life in over five continents.
90 countries, 50 of them with kids, spanning nine relocations. When she became a mother, she and her husband plotted their moves to align with their values of language acquisition and mastery for their children, their hobbies and seasons as a family. Now as a relocation coach, she helps others to do the same. By identifying their values, matching that to a country or a region and helping her clients
navigate all of the expected and unexpected turns of living the life less traveled. Thank you so much for joining me today, Doris. I am so happy to have you on the House of Peregrine podcast.
Doris Dario (02:07)
Thanks so much for having me, Mickelle
House Of Peregrine (02:09)
I want to dive right in because I think first off, I want to know what is and is not a relocation coach.
Doris Dario (02:17)
Okay, that's right away. Relocation coaching, unlike relocation agents, as a relocation coach, I help people, families, to get clear on really what they want and how they want to design a new life abroad. So it's really about not, it's not about finding visas, finding right away the location or, you know, housing, etc. It's really about going
quite a step back and figuring out what your why is in the first place. So what really drives you? Why do you want to do this? What is your priority right now as a family or as a couple or as an individual? And then secondly, to really figure out how to do this new thing. It's not about changing location. It's really about thriving in this new environment and this new chapter in your life abroad, which is quite challenging in itself.
my role as a relocation coach is really to guide them on this journey and to make it fun, to make it really an exciting chapter rather than just a, I've got to have to move somewhere.
House Of Peregrine (03:25)
Yeah. And would you say, so we are very familiar with coaches in other realms of our life, business coaches, individual coaches, therapists, even midwives or doctors for different goals we have. We are all very familiar in our cultures with a coach, but I'm not sure that anyone would think to hire a relocation coach for this sort of transition. And so do you find that's a new...
or not new, but maybe just a niche offering.
Doris Dario (03:51)
It is indeed a niche of a niche. I think you spotted you mentioned the right word midwife. It's actually like somebody who creates space and who holds that space for you to be able to find your inner strength and your confidence, because everyone is able to do it. But we're just unsure we've got these fears put onto us from everyone else around us. And so it's really about
helping others to really find that space and to really empower themselves to take this next step, to go out of their comfort zone. It's a hard one, but it's possible for everyone.
House Of Peregrine (04:29)
Yeah. And so I want to back up. How did you get to be doing what you're doing? I know you have a story, a book out, and these things are, they don't come from nowhere. So I would love to hear a little bit of how you tell your story about living in all these amazing places.
Doris Dario (04:44)
So I'm originally from South Tyrol, which is a German speaking part of Italy. So I already grew up between two worlds, the German very extreme world and Italian very easy world.
House Of Peregrine (04:56)
For those of you who are
on video, she's doing this with her hands, like Italian. She's mentioning, she's motioning from the heart and emoting. Yeah.
Doris Dario (04:59)
Hahaha!
My Italian side comes out.
so I grew up in this small village in the Dolomites, in the mountains, in the Alps. And very early on, I felt this urge to just see what's beyond. You know, it's such a beautiful area. It's amazing. But for me, it was a feeling there must be more to it. And so I started very early to explore beyond.
I insisted with my parents that I wanted to do an au pair in France when I was 16. I wanted to work at the Garder Lake. I wanted to really do things away from home. And as soon as I hit 20, I went to university in Bologna, which is an eight hour drive away from home. And from there, I basically started exploring all of Europe and then pretty much the whole world. And it's when I realized that is what makes me happy.
So I've been traveling for many years. I met my partner along the Spanish. eventually we wanted to start a family and we were a bit in between this myth by the society telling you once you have children, it, fun is over. You've got to settle down. You've got to do things the proper way, get a proper job, et cetera. So we fell for it and we did settle down in London for a few years.
And but soon enough, we had this urge, it was just work, work, you know, just childcare work. And it just wasn't working for us. So we sat down intentionally, and we really started to design our own life that would be creating a life around our family rather than, you know, around our work. So that was the start of saying, actually, let's just do something else.
insisted while we negotiated with our employers, this was 2009, so that was well before COVID, to be able to work remotely. that started, eventually we got the green light, both of us, and that started this new chapter where we actually, with our kids, we had two by that First lived in Northern Italy for a bit, then down in Spain, and eventually we moved, basically we are now moving every two, three years.
House Of Peregrine (07:10)
So you decentered work and centered your family. And that I find, and I want to get to the rest of kind of your journey a little bit, but that moment of decentering what people tell you, you need to center your life around in the way you, that's a big moment. sometimes only in hindsight, but realizing in a way, and this has been my experience, you...
Doris Dario (07:11)
as a family.
That's right.
House Of Peregrine (07:36)
what you've been told, it's not a lie, but it's maybe just not true for you.
Doris Dario (07:41)
That's right. That's right. And when I say decentering, when you mentioned decentering, it's not that work takes less of a priority. It's just physically it has moved around. So by being able to center my life around my family, it makes me happier. And those hours that I do work, I work very extremely efficiently because I have this balance between
you know, my priorities.
House Of Peregrine (08:07)
Yeah.
And again, you mentioned COVID. So you're doing this before where there's actually not a lot of maps. And I was kind of the same in my journey. So felt like a little bit of a digital nomad in like 2013 to 2015. Fell for it, like you said. Fell for it that I had to stay rooted once I had kids. Ended up just completely kind of abandoning that assumption.
and decentering our experience as a family as well. But when you do that, you actually either have to make it up as you go, you have to bring your partner along, and there's no map. And so having someone like you to talk to about that is really valuable. It would have been really valuable for me. And I found my people, and all of us do, in different kinds of individuals that honor this path.
But having actually a wise person to sit with you and tell you what to expect, it's something that maybe people don't know they need. And so when they find you in their story, is it usually after this, I don't want to call it a crisis moment, but this moment of realizing they need to, they've decentered something and now they need to reorient towards what they want to center towards. Is that maybe where you meet a lot of your clients?
Doris Dario (09:26)
Exactly, usually it's
It's not a common role and people don't know the existence of a relocation coach. And most people upfront is like, I don't need this because all I need is a visa and it's housing. But once they realized there's so much more, there's so many more questions that, those late night questions at night when you can't sleep and you need answers to. And these were exactly the questions that I felt along the way. And I was hoping to have to find somebody.
I could look up to and to say, yes, this is all right, you can do this. To give this allowance, the permission to actually do things differently from just the way it is. You're now a parent and that's it, then you've got to do things the way they're supposed to be done. So that was the main reason why I started. I resigned from my job, which I had been in for 15 years, an agency in remotely.
to actually set this up because I felt there's so many people out there who fail in this process of relocating because they just focus on the logistics. Whereas the logistics is tricky, but really the hard part is the mindset part. So if that's worked on as a group, as a family, if that's who you're relocating with, then that is the main mean for happiness and success.
let's call it success. mean, success is very relative anyway.
House Of Peregrine (10:53)
Yeah. And do you see this is, and not everyone who moves abroad does it as a couple, but I'm really very interested at times in the statistics around couples who relocate and the higher than already high divorce rate or separation rate in this population. Do you think part of that is because they don't align on values before they don't know the adventure they're each on?
Is that a way to describe it or how would you describe this?
Doris Dario (11:18)
Yes.
Absolutely.
And I see it every day with clients, especially with couples, I take a lot on the role of mediator, because there's a lot of things that are not said, that are just assumed. I assumed you want this, and I assumed you always love that. Whereas obviously we change, we evolve, so we do change our preference anyway. And the main problem I see, with, if there's a couple where one of the two
to move abroad for work related and the other person turns into the trailing spouse. I hate the word trailing spouse by the way, because it's just so violent. But that's where the problem starts because the only person who is communicated with is the one who gets the job. So they talk to the agent and they take all the decisions for themselves, for their partner and for their whole family. And that's where things go pretty wrong because
you know, the other person gives up their job, gives up their livelihood, their friends, their family and everything in order to, go with them. And it's almost, I always hear it, from my clients, it's always like a suffering and it's like a sacrifice that I do for my partner. And it's not about being a sacrifice, know, partnerships are not about sacrificing. It's about celebrating each other and thriving on each other.
So it is really about very important to sit down and talk to things through talk about the expectations, and really getting aligned and clear on how do we want to do this in the new place before doing it.
House Of Peregrine (12:52)
Yeah.
I want to go back to something you just said, which was trailing spouse is a violent term. Please expound on that. And then I want to continue because that's a very compelling thing you just said.
Doris Dario (13:05)
I just feel, I mean, you know, that the term trail is that pull someone behind you and it almost sounds like a force. That it's, you want to do this and then everybody else, you're basically training them behind you. And it's, I just feel it should be, one unit that decides this one thing and they're all on, you're in this together.
and they create this new chapter together and that's when you thrive and that's when you create happiness and that's when it turns into success. And otherwise there's always this resentment and along the way I've seen so many couples where it happens there's this resentment and along the way, you I gave up this for you and I did this for you and now, you want something in return and it's not what you expected. And that's when things go sideways. And it's really sad, especially when there's children involved.
House Of Peregrine (13:51)
Yep. Yep.
Doris Dario (13:56)
because they are the ones who suffer most in this and then they have to move back and it's all a failure and it's this sense of failure of not having succeeded when it has an easy solution. ⁓
House Of Peregrine (14:08)
Yeah,
yeah, it's an easy solution, but it's not actually obvious if you've never done it before. So I always like to say, lot of our listeners know I gave a TED talk about women and how they don't set up their lives financially and how I would like them to have these conversations. But I always say, what I said in there is whenever you get married, it's for the first time. You don't know the questions to ask. You need the wisdom of others.
to ask the right questions. And that occurs to me that's a little bit the same here. Like if you've never moved abroad before, you don't know what to ask. And so that first step of just not knowing what you don't know is super important. And so I think doing this in a very mindful way is something that people don't know they need to do. And so I love what you're doing is this mediation of wisdom, bringing structure to this process of
Why are we doing this? What is our mission as a couple, as a family, as an individual even? Even if you're moving without anyone else, and especially if you are, you still need to know what success and failure looks like. You need to know your whys. You need to know your values because guess what? At least in my experience, they just changed the moment you decided to leave your country. And now everything's kind of floating around until you put it back down and to...
put it together a different way. And so I love the notion that there would be a mediator for something that's so far unnavigated by that individual. Important in every aspect of life, but this one I think could potentially save a relationship a lot of money, a lot of pain. And I love how you add fun in there. I say the word vitality because I think vitality, it...
Doris Dario (15:34)
Yes.
House Of Peregrine (15:51)
encompasses things that aren't fun but are vital. And so it occurs to me that you're adding a lot of vitality into this process.
Doris Dario (15:54)
Yes.
I like the term vitality because it's funny how we as humans, when there's something that you've got to do, then automatically it needs to be suffering, it needs to be hard and it needs to be stressful and it doesn't have to. It's all in your mind so you can turn it around and even these goodbyes, this closing of one chapter.
dismantling your house, deciding what comes with you, what can stay, know, what you can give away. It's such an important and such a mindful and intense process that you got to enjoy. It's not about, know, let's just close this and do the next thing. It's actually this whole preparation, which is fun. So I always say your relocation doesn't start the moment you land in a new place. It starts the moment you actually decide that you want to do this.
That's when it starts and that whole process needs to be joyful because especially with children, they need to see this is something exciting, this is something fun, this is something to look forward to rather than seeing your parents just stressing around and just making this all very scary. So that makes a huge difference in the way they actually arrive in a new place and are open to these new experiences.
House Of Peregrine (17:09)
Yeah, so translating your mission, or I don't like the word mission, but your purpose onto your children, that's really important. Like, why are we doing this? Because it's going to be hard also. It's going to be amazing, but it's going to be hard. You're learning a language. Often children take the brunt of the language learning in the family. That's going to be hard. Having a mission-driven relocation makes, and translating that to your kids if you have them, think is a really important step.
I want to go back to what you said because I think it's really important and it's something that we actually do at House of Peregrine, which is make it sacred. Whether or not that is your, we don't like the religious part of that word. You don't have to take it on, but make your life sacred. So have ceremony around what you're doing. Why not? Why not make this sacred? And so I love that because when you're in the midst of a move,
Doris Dario (17:47)
Yeah.
House Of Peregrine (18:05)
you
do not have the presence of mind to recognize this packing of this box and this giving away as ceremony. And it only happens after you've done a few moves maybe that you learn what your particular goodbye ceremony might be. And so to have the presence of mind to make that holy also gives you part of your life back and it gives a sense of dignity that I think is really beautiful.
Doris Dario (18:27)
Yep.
And it's very important what you say because it's the creation. So when you move to a new place, you know, it's about this creation of home. But for me, the creation of home is really about, you know, bringing along some routines. They're important and they are needed. And also these ceremonies, as you mentioned, but it's all sorts of ceremonies. it's...
things that I bring in from my culture, my husband brings in from his Spanish culture, and we blend it into our, this is, these are our ceremonies, this is our sacred space. And it's even, when you, when we move abroad, we've learned this with each move, we've developed this sort of ceremony that is ours. So we have these goodbye parties with everyone, where we have these friend books where everybody signs, we put in the pictures in there.
And they are vital, especially when it gets a new place. I see my kids, looking through these friends books and it's this process of digesting, this recent move. So it's all these little ceremonies that we just create as we go along and they give us the stability that you need to be able to continue doing this because that's the most important one.
House Of Peregrine (19:34)
Yep. Yep. Yep.
Doris Dario (19:43)
that people mentioned, but you know, what about the stability? What about your kids being on the road? You know, they need their stability, they need their routines, need their friends, and that's what you need to create. So it's something that we create very consciously when we move to new place. So we wrap up the old one, we close this chapter very mindfully, and then we start in the new one with these, thanks to these routines that give us that stability.
House Of Peregrine (20:08)
It occurs to me that the difference between trauma and not trauma is how you, it's not what happens to you, it's how, what happens after or during. And so you really can make it the difference between trauma and not. And that's for all of life, but maybe people don't realize that it applies here. And so when you're working with an individual, a couple, a family, how...
Do you, how do you walk me through that process? What, it's different for each person, I can assume. But what are you, and it occurs to me that it's very much like birth. I had a midwife when I gave birth to my three kids. She basically gave me the scaffolding and the support to have my experience, whatever that experience wanted to be, but she was there to hold the safety, the.
expected like what's expected what's unexpected right like what are the boundaries and when to worry when not to worry you know yeah and that
Doris Dario (21:03)
Exactly. And just
like a midwife, it's interesting. I really love this comparison with the midwife.
because it's to set the framework, but to have this flexibility, all these options in between to choose from, that it's not the one way. If you want to sit on the ball, then you can sit on the ball, we're talking about midwifing. If you want to kneel, you still have the ability to choose within the framework. So that you still have this feeling that this is you, that you are deciding.
on how to do this. And this is your birth, your life basically. So yes, the way we work is that we start to go quite a bit back. I like to, even though coaching is about the present and the future, it's not about the past, but just for this very exercise, I love to go back and just love to hear the experiences as a family, as a couple, as an individual.
you know, how much they've traveled, how much, if they ever moved and what that experience was like. And it's always interesting because just the moment we start talking about their experiences, they realize how much they actually know already, how much they've done so many things along the way already, we just forget. And so that is quite an important exercise to, to really start with, with building that self-confidence. Yes, you know, I can do this, even though it's quite early in the process.
And at that point, people usually are still very doubtful and just want to see how this, it's still too far in distance. We then work on quite a few sessions on our values and our passions. And when I say passions, it's not, you know, the classic, you've got to have a passion. It's really just unlayering and understanding what is it that drives you? What is it that makes you get excited about things?
And so it's really about going deeper and then finding the common ground. And it's an exercise that it's very powerful because selecting within a list of values, it's easy peasy, but it is very powerful because you really go much, much deeper than anticipated. And once we really get clear on these ones, and these are individual exercises that we then combine in conversations as a group, or if it's just an individual, we...
We talk about this and then once we've really gotten clear about it, we start imagining this new life abroad. We do sort of an exercise to just picturing it. And that's when the fun starts because now we really try and see, what a day looks like, what a week looks like, how I really envision what kind of accommodation, you know, really.
Based on do I want to walk everywhere? Do I want to be really in the middle of nowhere? Do I need people? There's so many questions and it's, I always see people assume, sort of first question is, which part of the city is the expat city? Which is where, that's not the point. You don't want to go into the same bubble. I mean, the whole point of moving abroad is to actually experience this new place. So let's see, what are the options?
House Of Peregrine (23:58)
Yep.
Doris Dario (24:09)
And which of these options appeal to you as this new experience? You don't want to recreate your old life and do it exactly the same way as the new one because it's not gonna happen. It's all gonna be a disaster. So you may as well just embrace this new environment and make the best of it and try to live something quite different from what you've been used to. And that triggers and unleashes so many new situations. It even helps you to...
and to get to know your partner in a new way, just because your surrounding is different, to rediscover different strengths of your children. this is pretty much... Yes, yes. ⁓
House Of Peregrine (24:50)
It's an adventure.
I want to go back though, because this works, this process works because I'm assuming you have people who come to you that both have a choice in location and actually don't have a choice in location. And so this process works for either of those. But when they don't have a location, they just know they need a change. Do you help them through that process of identifying a place that might work with their values?
Doris Dario (25:20)
Yeah, that comes after we work through the values, the passions and really to understanding your why, why you're doing this. And that's when we really look at the whole world. And we then start slowly but surely through a series of questions to really filter down and making a selection and then another selection and then really set priorities and understand what is really out of these, know, characteristic out of these.
important points, which, which wins, right? So it's, it's really a very interesting exercise of even considering places, that they've never even considered just based on their values and what they really love and the kind of life they envision. And it's, very interesting how they then come back to me saying, I didn't even look at these options or these this continent or this region. And now you've opened this
So my job is really about opening up options and taking informed decisions rather than just, I've heard somebody move to France and so I want to move to France because I saw these pictures and it's like, wow, there's so much more behind it.
House Of Peregrine (26:23)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. And it occurs to me that you are helping them through that process. But have you seen a big change in the reasons people are relocating over the last five years? What do you when you sense that someone is running away instead of towards an experience? What do you tell them or how do you help them to place that?
Doris Dario (26:49)
It's very interesting when you say that it has indeed changed over past few years, especially with since COVID, was this hype of remote work and, know, I can work from everywhere. And then now with the back to office, it has changed again. And now there's a lot of people I work with are based on political reasons for just safety reasons or lifestyle reasons as well.
But what I try to tell them is, I'm not trying to convince anyone to do anything. In fact, I even had a family who just, it just felt right away. They are trying to run away from something. They were just not happy with the way they were running their lives right now. So we looked into it and we analyze it and they got to a realization that actually all they need is to change.
a few things, change a few ways in their current life right now. They don't need to move abroad to become happy, to become more intentional, to spend more time with their family. They can actually do it where they are right now because they were not able to move away because their parents were elderly. so, it doesn't mean that that's the only way, but it means getting clear on why is it, what is it that I need? What change is it I need?
maybe it's a change that I can apply where I am right now. And, I can thrive again. So it's not really about just, you different country and that's the solution to all your problems. It's not.
House Of Peregrine (28:08)
Yeah.
Go.
Yeah, because it is a massive commitment in time, in money, in transformation, in emotional. And so it's not, it's again, like I hate to keep bringing it back to having kids, like, it's not, having a child will not fix a relationship. And similar, and I say this with a lot of respect, but if you're having problems in your relationship and you think a changing country,
Doris Dario (28:34)
No. No.
House Of Peregrine (28:43)
will change that without some other kinds of work. The saying, wherever you go, there you are, applies here. And I found that to be true in my own life and in friends' lives. Your relationship patterns follow you. What I would say, the caveat I would put to that is a change in scenery can and usually does change power dynamics for better or worse.
And it is an opportunity to change things. But doing that without a lot of awareness is a dangerous and expensive game.
Doris Dario (29:18)
Yes, it's a risky one and that's why it's my goal is always to, you know, not beautify, it's not, Instagrammable pictures everywhere, you know, it's not. I really insist that you got to, to look at, you know, make it very realistic so that people really know what they're up against and then they can decide, am I ready for this? Do I feel, I can do this?
But if I don't know the whole, the full picture, it's really hard. And once you know it and you take the decision, that is very empowering. that is, it's, it, yeah.
House Of Peregrine (29:50)
Yeah.
It makes a very nutritious experience instead of a superficial one. You still get the beautiful Instagram photos, by the way, with the side of satisfaction of knowing you're living your values and that you're actually doing something that you really want and to invest in. And again, for me, it's a lot like having children. Like when I have three children, when someone asks me if they should have children, I say, it depends.
Same way I ask if people say, should I move abroad? I'm like, listen, is it something you want? Because it's a big and time investment. It's a lot of paperwork. Is it worth it? It totally is. You should totally move abroad, and you should totally have children if you're willing to dedicate the time that is required for the happiness that comes out the other side.
Doris Dario (30:32)
Okay.
But it's not for everyone. So I think that it's also quite important to say, you know, it's not the only way. There's many different ways of doing this. it's and what I also say, you don't have to sell your house right away and move to Bali next week. maybe you can just start trying it out. maybe you go for a vacation for a month somewhere or you take a three month sabbatical, just get a taste of it.
House Of Peregrine (30:36)
It's not for everyone.
Doris Dario (31:00)
And then if you feel like this actually adds to our relationship, this really makes me happy. I feel there's some transformation happening. This helps me thriving. Then you can expand and maybe go bigger and bolder. But it's not about one or the other. Well, with kids it's a bit different, obviously. You can borrow your sisters and try it out, but obviously.
House Of Peregrine (31:22)
Yeah, kids are a little different that way. But I do think that it's really easy to think that you can run away and everything will be different. And it's just not, it's not it. What I would say is it's an adventure of a lifetime and there's no other way to transform and know yourself in the way that moving to another culture does. You learn about yourself in a way that is
transformative and you can't get that experience any other way. And so it almost happens to you.
Doris Dario (31:53)
Yes, and it's what I like because, this transformation, it's allowing yourself to reinvent yourself, yourself and your children. And I've seen it with my kids that, my daughter was very shy and very drawn in and
that seemed like it was her, know, her stamp on her forehead, I'm shy, that's it. And then we moved from Northern Ireland to Switzerland. And suddenly, I don't know if it was, the surrounding or the new class or some other girls who just got this very outgoing personality out of her and she just completely transformed. Now, if we had stayed back, maybe she would have, but not in this, know, thriving way.
of just being able to just reinvent herself and being allowed to suddenly be somebody else. And then seeing that actually it works and it's, and she, you could tell, she really enjoys this new 'her'. And so the same is with us adults that we think we are one way and then we actually allow to try out different things. And I'm not saying that we are faking it, but we're trying out different personalities of different ways of being, of behaving,
of living your life and back home you wouldn't be allowed to do it because everybody would say, you what are you doing? We all know you. And so it's, I think that is a big experience that is not spoken about.
House Of Peregrine (33:14)
not spoken about, but it definitely, if you do move to the partner and a long-term partner, if you don't know that's what's happening and that's possible, it can be very scary if your partner's changing and trying on new things and everything from small things to big things, right? ⁓
Doris Dario (33:29)
Exactly.
it's, when the first few times I remember my partner telling me, you've changed because you've never been like this. And I tried to reframe it. Is that a positive thing or a negative thing? Because I feel that is positive. we are evolving, we're changing. If we always was the same, if we were stuck in that same place, that's quite sad.
House Of Peregrine (33:52)
Yeah. And that is the gift and the crucible of living in different places. Because we all have, maybe it's less known or less accepted that there are many selves inside. And people who speak multiple languages, I'm not one of them, but I have been told that when you speak a different language, different parts of you come out. So you have, at least my kids tell me, when they speak Dutch, they feel like they have a certain part of them. When they speak English, they have a certain part of them.
And so I want to talk about that a little bit because you, that was a big value for you personally when with your moves once you had children was language mastery. and tell me about that. Tell me about that process and how, how it's turned out. Cause your children are now older.
Doris Dario (34:31)
Yes, so we were
in Spain, we had moved from London to Spain, and so they all started school. And I remember that started English as a second language. And so it was common all the other parents would send their kids to after school activities, English, after school activities twice a week. So I was thinking if that's what I have to do with three kids twice a week, taking them to these English classes, apart from the cost and the time, it's quite an investment.
And then I would listen to older kids speaking English quite poorly. I thought this is not what I want to do. we really wanted to, so we said, let's go to an English speaking country, immerse them, and then they've got perfect, beautiful English. And that's it. And then we come back. That was the initial plan. It was just to go there for a couple of years and then come back to Spain. And that's when we decided for Northern Ireland because we wanted something quite...
you know, we didn't want to go back to London and just warming up a cold soup in a sense. So we wanted to experience something new. So was this hidden gem and education system is one of the best in Northern Ireland. So we decided for that. Plus my husband is an avid surfer. So that was an addition one. And it was amazing. Within three months they spoke. Absolutely.
beautiful Northern Irish, English with a Northern Irish accent. And that's what they kept. They've changed, their accent is now quite softened, but that's something they've taken with them. So from there, I felt like, you if this is so easy, let's take the next step. So we went to Switzerland. they can, I spoke to them in German, but they never, they were not able to read and write in German. So that's when we decided for Switzerland.
So they would go to German school, the whole German education also during, so they were between four and eight years old. And in that age time, the education in Switzerland is focused on the outdoors, on the social skills and the arts. So that was something that I was really, I could relate to. didn't want them to just sit eight hours, which is what they do in more Mediterranean countries where it's lots of theory.
I wanted them to experience an education system that is quite alternative, let's say. So that's what we did in those years. then from there, I wanted to, they hold an Italian passport, but then didn't speak Italian. our thinking was let's go to the Italian part of Switzerland. And so again, it was an immersion, zero language knowledge by them. And within three months they started.
House Of Peregrine (36:47)
Yeah.
Doris Dario (37:06)
even started moving their hands and it was the whole bit. And so after that experience, two years in Lugano, we then decided to come back to Spain now to strengthen their roots because that is always a bit of a risk. Home is everywhere but nowhere. So we really wanted strengthen their roots before they then go off.
And now it's quite interesting because my eldest, turns 18 this summer, you were asking before how that it has turned out. And so now he's ready to go to university. And so he's been looking at all these universities and now he decided to go to the Netherlands out of all the places because it's an English, it's all taught in English. And he just feels he wants to be surrounded by international people.
House Of Peregrine (37:38)
Yeah.
Doris Dario (37:55)
make good use of all the languages he speaks. Now he speaks five languages and so Dutch eventually will be his sixth one. so that's quite interesting. It comes full circle. ⁓
House Of Peregrine (38:00)
Yeah.
Yep.
And so what I hear you saying is language was your guide through your children's childhood and your life with your children in their childhood. That guided you. And then you had a goal of having them have a strong base in Spain. And so that was your that was kind of whether or not you knew it at the time, that was what was guiding your decisions, whether they were intuitive, because there was no one doing this at the time. Right. Like you were you were pioneer.
Doris Dario (38:21)
That's right.
Except.
We
never had a plan. was always, we only had a two year plan and then things just evolved and we realized things. Also in between, for each birth of my children, I would go back to my home place. So we would live there for six months and the kids would go to kindergarten school there. Just so that they have their little roots there as well. It's quite hard because they're third culture kids. it means...
they, you have to celebrate two cultures plus the one where they are growing up in. So it is true, my background is linguistics. And that's why I have this, it's an important thing for me. I consider it being a gift for my children. It's the biggest gift I can give to my children. So that's quite an individual thing for me, focusing on the languages and education system as such, whereas other people, have
have different priorities and that's what we work out in the work I do with them to figure out what is your priority? What is it that guides you? What's your guiding star?
House Of Peregrine (39:35)
Yeah, and that's super important. it is. But I share. my guiding light was I wanted to give my children a language. And when people say they speak a language and they have a language, I think there's a big difference. I wanted them to have a second language and that experience of having a second language. And so that required that they leave, get it, start having it in their body relatively early, which is what my
My husband and I had the goal of they couldn't live their past. They had to start being bilingual by the time they were five. That was the absolute cutoff. And we moved to the Netherlands the day my son turned five. So not a moment too soon. But those goals are, I guess my point in telling you that story is these goals are important. Otherwise no one's going to help you make these. Everything leads to staying in a single location. And so if you have these goals, it's really important to name them. We'll first identify them.
Doris Dario (40:08)
Wow.
Yes.
House Of Peregrine (40:25)
name them and then put action to them because you're the only one that's going to make this happen if these are your values. And so when as you guide couples through these values, you help them through the transition, what is the process, wrapping up the process with you look like? And I'm sure it's, your clients can always call you and re-engage, but as a coach,
Doris Dario (40:45)
Yes. ⁓
House Of Peregrine (40:47)
What is the completion of that first phase of values and relocation? Tell me about that.
Doris Dario (40:54)
So there's two options. It's either the work we do before relocation. So in preparation of relocation, normally around six months before moving, or even if you don't have even an idea of a date or a location or anything, it's really just getting started. And that's four sessions or four weeks where we really focus on the pre, on the preparation, but also on a mindset where I work on reset to zero mindset, sort of to,
get rid of all these expectations, or if you have expectations, manage them realistically. then it really gets over to the actual move and that's when it gets more practical. So I guide them throughout the move, but also post-move. And that's quite an important one, just like in birth. And I really like this comparison, know, everything works towards the birth. You the day of the birth, you prepared all perfectly, but you never really prepare the afterwards. Yeah. And so...
Just like, there's this, the after birth depression, all sorts of different symptoms that can occur that you're not really prepared for. The same is with the relocation. And I've noticed there is usually about three months into the relocation into being in a new place, three to six months, there's a big low where you think, you actually, you're over your initial.
dopamine and adrenaline and everything and actually start settling in. There's lots of things that you notice that don't go exactly the way you thought they would go. And that's when you start questioning your decision. Is this, was this the right decision? and we all have this dip and I think it's important to understand it will happen. And the key is how to prepare for it to, to, to go through it more easily and just while still thriving.
And so it's quite important that the guidance doesn't finish the moment you move, but there's still, especially the settling in and this dip, this three months load that we prepared for it and then we plan around it.
House Of Peregrine (42:50)
Yeah.
House Of Peregrine (42:51)
For me, it's very important in birth and in relocation and immigration to realize that millions of years of women and millions of years of people have experienced this before. So anything I'm feeling probably isn't new. And so that for me helps me feel, get through these, or it did help me get through.
the things that may have seemed unovercomeable, become
Doris Dario (43:17)
Mm-hmm.
House Of Peregrine (43:17)
overcomable when you know that you're not the only one that's experienced it. But having a guide to tell you, just like when I had my babies, like, this is going to happen probably within these few days, this is going to happen within these. It really helps you not to freak out and keep perspective. And so that is a similar thing. For me, it took a lot longer to have that.
Doris Dario (43:28)
I'm the
House Of Peregrine (43:37)
because of how we moved. we were doing it completely on our own. And then my partner had different phases. He wasn't here here until a few years in. So he was still traveling quite a bit. So we were in that
first phase for quite a long time, actually. The honeymoon phase or feeling like you live on a vacation phase lasted a lot longer for us.
Doris Dario (43:52)
Yes.
Thank you.
House Of Peregrine (43:57)
And part of that I think is because we prepared well. Like we got to live the sweet moments of that a lot longer because we knew our values and we knew why we were doing these hard things. So I think that really made a difference. Without knowing it, we were coming up with our values as a family and living them. Yeah. But I do wish I had, yeah, mean, different years are different, but I wish we would have had someone like you to give us that perspective. And so I'm really happy that you're doing the work you're doing.
Doris Dario (44:11)
Mm-hmm.
Fantastic. And you're thriving.
House Of Peregrine (44:25)
because I do think there's a new kind of person who's attempting this. And it does well, it's not just those of us who were digital nomads in the early 2000s, and now we're growing up and we're questioning things. It's people who do need a different kind of life just to live their own personal journey. And I feel like there's a different kind of person attempting this and that calls for a different kind of guidance. And that makes it generative for
the people but also the place they're going because if traumatized people show up in a place that also affects the place.
And so I think the work you're doing is very
important for this new, what I see as an additional population of people who are attempting this type of life, living values based around the world, anywhere can be the place that they're aligned with their values. This is somewhat new in our generations. And so, yeah, I just appreciate what you're doing.
So how, I'm mindful of your time, so I want to wrap up. How can people get a hold of you? What is the ideal time for someone if they're thinking of maybe even having a stirring of I may want to live abroad? How does that work?
Doris Dario (45:36)
I think, it's usually it's people who just have this thought, what if, you know, what if, and it's still very, very early days, and they only just started talking about it. So I always say, the moment you have these thoughts, write it down, you know,
put it into words, speak to somebody, speak to your partner, to your friends about it. And that's the initiation of this new process and of this new chapter. And then it's really about getting help to getting clearer because it's a lot of, there's so much information and I think it's even harder now. You think now you've got all this, you've got all the information is online, you've got Chat GTP who can help you with anything, but it's too much information.
rather than looking for information out there, know, look for information in here, because it's all in you. It just needs to be sorted in order than put into words and into thoughts, know, proper thoughts, rather than having all this chaos in your mind that you would like to, but there's all these spots and all these things that keep you back. So that's where it really helped. So it's really about asking the right questions so that you get to think about the things that
that help you take a decision or just developing this idea, whichever shape or form that takes on because you can even invent something completely new. There's millions of ways of just doing this, of creating a new life anywhere. So that's really the basic. So my message is really to listen to yourself and if you have this snugging voice,
that, positively nagging voice that just makes you feel like this more to it, you know, make in, give it, give it space, create space for that, for that. Because it's not going to go away. You may end up just suppressing it. And at some point, it will come out enough. I'm speaking with a lot of people also who, who now have their, their kids who just leave the nest. And it's people who
always wanted to do this kind of experience and now they feel like now is the time but everyone else around you tells you what are you going to do you know at your age where are you going to go at your age and and that's when you want somebody who actually believes in you more than you believe in yourself to be able to to actually start this process and just doing it
House Of Peregrine (47:48)
So true. So listen to yourself as usual, but there's people who have done this and people who want to help you do this and you're one of them. And so, and do it successfully in a way that you, yeah, you can think about you've had a life on your own terms successfully. That's beautiful. All right. Well, people can reach you. What's the best way through your website?
Doris Dario (48:10)
Yes, so it's my website, dorisdario.com. I'm also on LinkedIn, again, Doris Dario, and I've got a newsletter, and I've also published a book this early January. It's called The Digital Nomad Family, and it's a guidance for people who have this thought to see what if. And it's really just a guide to get with lots of questions, lots of exercises, to really get into the mood and get into.
just looking into it and seeing what are the options, how could this look like for me? So it is part story of mine, part incentive and invitation to just give it a thought and perhaps this could be something for you.
House Of Peregrine (48:51)
Yeah, that's great. That's awesome because buying a book is a lot a good first seeing if this journey could be right for you. And then if people want to reach out, can they can make a consult with you to do you have like a consult that they first can talk to you.
Doris Dario (49:05)
Yes, so it's a free discovery call. I call it a free clarification call to just get clearer on what is it they're looking for right now and how is it, how could I possibly help them and guide them in this process?
House Of Peregrine (49:19)
Perfect. All right, so everyone reach out to Doris if you're having this little nagging, beautiful thought that you might want to live a little bit differently or in a different place. I want to thank you for coming on, Doris. I think this has been a delightful conversation and hopefully illuminating for people who didn't realize this kind of coaching was available in the world. I always say living abroad is an additional life stage and what your work is is feeling that.
exact niche that I think is so important. So thank you for coming on. Thank you for joining us and sharing your wisdom. And thank you everyone for listening to the House of Peregrine podcast. I'm happy to share this with you today and I look forward to hearing from you soon.
Doris Dario (49:59)
Thanks so much, Mickelle.